I noticed that the first and last names of the author of the book "The Linguistic Affinity of the Volgaic Finno-Ugrians and Their Ethnogenesis." have been incorrectly identified. In fact László is his first name, and Klima is his last name. I supposes this affects also references 6,9,10,11 and 13, where it should read Klima instead of László or Laslo but I'm not sure so I didn't change them. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.32.5.125 (talk) 17:13, 4 June 2010 (UTC)
I suggest to split existing article to 5 separate articles as existing text is a mixture of terms and history facts corresponding to different ethnic groups. Mordvin is not a self-designation for none of 5 mentioned ethnic groups. They are not a group or unity whose members identify with each other. They do not have common heritage, common ancestry, or common language. Mordvin language never existed. Eastern neighbors of mentioned ethnic groups recognize them as separate ethnic groups. Article stub for separate article Moksha (people) is here. --Jarmanj Turtash (talk) 12:28, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
If the definition of a language involves the existence of a literature, then Erzya has a two-hundred year old literary tradition commencing with the publication of a Catechism in 1806, the Gospel in 1821 and the first grammar in 1838-39 (Gabelentz). The Moksha literary tradition is slightly younger, beginning no later than 1838 with a grammar by Ornatov. To this date there has been no literature written in a hypothetical Mordvinic language, even the staunch proponent of a single Mordvin language, Nikolai Butylov, has never published an article in this proposed language. As the Moksha poet-play wright Pudin has stated "There is not a single young mother who has spoken to her babe in Mordvin, she speaks to that babe in Moksha or Erzya".
If the definition of an ethnic group has anything to do with a specific language and a specific culture, then the differences between Erzyas and Mokshas might be seen as cultural, as well. Unfortunately, scholarship in Erzya and Moksha studies has been concentrated into the hands of people with political agendas or ones lacking internal-perspectives, and descriptive interests. This might be seen to apply to the Erzya Mokshin and his two non-Erzya speaking daughters, by some.
The problem with external coercion by people unaware of the situation is that descriptive work is hardly ever supported. If the Mokshas are left alone because the Erzya have be coerced into assimilation, the Mokshas will miss them. If the Mokshas dissappear, the same is definitely true. Not being able to distinguish between algebra and trigonometry might just indicate a lack of knowledge in the "upper maths". The Erzyas and Mokshas are closely related, as might be expected due to mere proximity, but each group thrives on the knowledge of their own entities and the existence of a close sibling. Most recently, the Minister of Culture, Tultaev stated in a speech before the Finnish Diet (Eduskunta: Fall 2010) that three Mordvin languages are spoken, namely, Moksha, Erzya and Shoksha. Certainly, these three groups can live in harmony, with the Bible translated into Moksha and Erzya but not Shoksha. None of them have a navy or state. (Botuzhaleny-sodamo (talk) 12:19, 5 May 2011 (UTC))
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P.S.:Seems Vaultralph's idea was not to remove mentions of Baltic Finnic peoples or Judaism re Mordvins because I had removed them. He just reverts Russian DNA and recent Oxford Uralic studies because he personally just didn't like them. The bot is still not assigned to stop him.----Numulunj pilgae (talk) 06:37, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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Usually they always use the same tactics. First deleting images and lines/references, maybe once a month, then placing templates about the lack of sources/references and change/delete the article. What do they want? To roll back the article to Stalin's version of history. They don't like DNA studies the most. You don't believe in Kremlin bots? Read this about investigations of British ISD and CASM [1] They are easy to be traced by they deeds. The next image about difference between Mokshan and Erzyan languages as per glottochronological analyses is also nominated for deletion. I'll have to upload it again if I'm not be banned again. It's better using a bot against the bots, isn't it? Or you prefer Stalin's version, dear admins? The same problem with the long time ago approved article Gelons and Mordvins. It had just disappeared. I restored it with the more correct name and this is the correspondence re this vandalism issue from my talk page:
An article you recently created, Gelonians and Mordvins, is not suitable as written to remain published. It needs more citations from reliable, independent sources. (?) Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of "Draft:" before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline and thus is ready for mainspace, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page. Onel5969 TT me 12:38, 14 November 2022 (UTC)
A well-known professor's monograph kept in President Yeltsin's Library. What do you mean by "verifiability"? To exhumate president Yeltsin and check his fingerprints, or special approval of acting US or Russia presidents, or both? --Numulunj pilgae (talk) 16:22, 15 November 2022 (UTC) (talk) 05:33, 16 November 2022 (UTC)
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:
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Something is fishy with article content.
I suspect this resulted from edits of Numulunj pilgae in 2022, but I have no interest in this subject, so please someone else take a look into page history. - Altenmann >talk 08:17, 5 April 2024 (UTC)